>>New Target and Pay Per Lesson release - Down By The Water - The Decemberists

[thereshopeyet]

Thanks.

[TGNesh]

My point Dermot (please read the whole post and not just a few lines), it doesn't really matter if it's in the key of Em or G, both of them have the same chords. When you figure out Em, G, D.....then try the other chords in that keysignature and you'll find it. Thén hearing the Em as the resolving chord might be the answer to if it's the key of Em or G. Indeed, I'd say it's Em, since it circles around that chord.

Don't make it any more complicated then it is.....! :S Then again, that's you!

As for definitions, go back to basics Dermot, ACOUSTIC GENIUS SERIES, I definitely can't explain it any better than Neil does.



thereshopeyet wrote:

Vanessa Wrote:

So what's not to understand?

..... apart from Me :dry: ha ha !!!

When you wrote:

I'm sure you know at least the major and relative minor chord progressions, right?

I thought you were referring that I had the key wrong !

Remind me please, what's the definition of Major and minor progressions?

:S

[thereshopeyet]

Vanessa Wrote:

Please read the whole post and not just a few lines....

I did read the whole post..... but ..... the misunderstanding was mine.... I misheard the C as another Em.
then got myself in knots.

As for chord progressions, I thought you were making a specific point, and if you were, I missed it.
So will review at some point but right now I'm not getting distracted onto theory.... it's a can of worms.... big ones.

I know what you were meaning anyway.
Think of the Chords in a key and then listen for all of them and work out the chord progression.
I need to tune my ears better to recognise what I hear.


Review AGS....Too busy practicing at the moment, it's more light hearted and fun !

[suziko]

Funny, I never thought of this song as being in the key of Em. I guess because all the chords are in the key of G- and those are the same chords for Em- I just always thought of it as in the key of G. I suppose because it "resolves" on Em, it is in Em, but it almost seems like it doesn't really matter!

[Hydroman52]

suziko wrote:

Funny, I never thought of this song as being in the key of Em. I guess because all the chords are in the key of G- and those are the same chords for Em- I just always thought of it as in the key of G. I suppose because it "resolves" on Em, it is in Em, but it almost seems like it doesn't really matter!

I thought this way, too. . . . . until I started on the journey of songwriting. Generally, a Major Key = bright/happy while a Minor Key = dark/melancholy. One of the best ways I know to illustrate this is to play the Happy Birthday song progression (I / / V / / V / / I / / I / / IV / / I / V I / / where I=G; V=D; IV=C) in the Key of G. It sounds like a song that would be sung to a five-year-old child. Now play the same progression in the Key of Em (i / / v / / v / / i / / i / / iv / / i / v i / / where i=Em; v=Bm; iv=Am). It sounds more like how it might be played in a horror film.

I’ll try to attach an audio file or two to illustrate my point.

Hydroman52



EDIT: I've tried to attach some files here, but failed miserably. Sorry.


The lyrics to this song, Down By The Water, tend to lean toward the bummer side of the happiness scale ("See where all my folly’s led", "The season rubs me wrong", "So knock me down, tear me up", etc.), so I am guessing that Colin Meloy was trying to evoke a bit of sadness in using the Minor Key.

[TGNesh]

You're right Sue, it does circle around Em, so that one kinda functions as the I-chord. Both G and Em have the same keysignature, so it's likely that you'll bump into the same chords.

Another good example is Jar of Hearts (Christina Perri), the verses circle around Am and the chorus around C. Or 'Your Rocky Spine', the verses circle around Dm and the chorus around F. You could say, two keys (same keysignature) are being used for both tunes, same chords all over the songs. For Jar of Hearts I indeed checked Neil on it, who agreed that both keys are being used.

All in all, the 'resolving chord' is often the answer and even within a song there is more than one answer.

suziko wrote:

Funny, I never thought of this song as being in the key of Em. I guess because all the chords are in the key of G- and those are the same chords for Em- I just always thought of it as in the key of G. I suppose because it "resolves" on Em, it is in Em, but it almost seems like it doesn't really matter!

[thereshopeyet]

Thanks.

[TGNesh]

I thought you were too busy practicing!

Check the modes stuff Dermot!



thereshopeyet wrote:

Vanessa

So is it correct to say when looking from a ....
1. Major key perspective..... the relative minor.... 6th degree of scale has the same key signature.
2. From a minor key perspective..... the relative major..... 3rd degree of the scale has the same key signature.

Taking that further.... assuming your not borrowing chords from other keys......
Generally speaking a song can then be written in a major or minor key and can resolve to either throughout the course of the song but
one (major or minor key) would always be the primary key that the song verse / chorus would resolve to.

Dermot

Edit
I think that's what the circle of 5th's conveys.

[thereshopeyet]

Thanks.

[TGNesh]

I say AGS Dermot!

Edit: No, I say, go back to practicing!


thereshopeyet wrote:

Vanessa Wrote:

I thought you were too busy practicing!

Caught me an a ...................



Modes is another issue starting any major or minor key from any scale degree.
I suppose when using modes the resolving chord changes depending on the chosen mode.

Is that really the same as relative major / relative minor scenario.....

Can't get my head around that!