Theoretical mussings on Theory

Chasplaya
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 12:04 am

When building houses you don't just practice but work from plans which have been created in part with ... Theory/knowledge of Structure and Engineering. I think theory should be treated as one of the foundations from which to build (now if I had practiced what I preach here i'd probably be a shade better than I am)


__m__
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 12:07 am

Chasplaya wrote:
When building houses you don't just practice but work from plans which have been created in part with ... Theory/knowledge of Structure and Engineering. I think theory should be treated as one of the foundations from which to build (now if I had practiced what I preach here i'd probably be a shade better than I am)

oooh Good one. Should have got that one as I WORK CONSTRUCTION FOR A LIVING!!! *sigh* I couldn't help it Reiver got me on the whole automtotive thing... :blush:


Chasplaya
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:26 am

__m__ wrote:
Chasplaya wrote:
When building houses you don't just practice but work from plans which have been created in part with ... Theory/knowledge of Structure and Engineering. I think theory should be treated as one of the foundations from which to build (now if I had practiced what I preach here i'd probably be a shade better than I am)

oooh Good one. Should have got that one as I WORK CONSTRUCTION FOR A LIVING!!! *sigh* I couldn't help it Reiver got me on the whole automtotive thing... :blush:
Sorry _m_ couldn't help that, I was actually writing more when my Virus programme shut me down, so spent the next 2 hours fixing PC. I was also going to add about theory its useful if you play with others. recent example the Police Band I play with were getting ready to practice Luka by Suzanne Vega, now the bass player insisted it was in G and I insisted capo on 2nd fret in F#, now we had a couple of newbies in the band giving us blank stares cos they had absolutely no idea what were discussing.


BigBear
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:40 am

Tony- I can't pass on this one! All these posters are correct but I think you have to ask yourself the question what do you want to do with the knowledge if you were to learn it? Knowledge gained should either be practical or theoretical. Either you want to do something useful with the knowledge or you just want to acquire it because you find it interesting.

I love Reiver's quote "It may make me a better musician but it wont make me a better guitarist". It is absolutely true! If you just want to play and learn songs written by someone else you really don't need much theory. Learning it would just be for general interest.

But if you want to do anything with music other than play it, like writing your own songs, or playing in a band or transposing it to a better key to sing in or doing a better job of remembering songs because you understand I-IV-V chord construction or...on and on, some theory is really beneficial.

I'm not convinced I need to fully understand Hypophrygian modes but there is a lot of theory I do find very useful.

Cheers! :cheer:


Lavallee
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:43 am

I think theory is more important if you are composing or playing with other people and you need to make arrangment. It would also be good for soloing where you need to understand what is going on during the song. I do not think you need theory if you will play exactly an already written song. Even then there is more to know, if you want to spend the time and understand the logic behind a song

But as with wine, if you know a bit of what is going on, you will not just buy a bottle and drink it, you will select the grape variety you like, with the food that goes together, bring the wine at the right temperature, put it in a carafe to oxidize it a bit, when tasting it , you will look and appreciate the color and the viscosity in the glass, roll it and smell it and slowly drink it allowing air with it and let it go down you throat for a complete enjoyment. At the end the result is the same, you drink it, but if you know a bit about wine the second approach seems to justify buying wine, not just alcohol.

It is just the same with guitar and theory.Keep it simple or try to understand what you are doing. Whatever you choose, you still going to play guitar. The question is which approach gives you more pleasure and enjoyment.

Marc


tovo
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:16 am

You post a thread hoping to get some good discussion, this is great and there are some real gems in here. At this stage I am leaning slightly toward the case for the negative led by Reiver but hoping for more views.


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neverfoundthetime
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:42 am

.....but hoping for more views.
Tony, you are a hard man to please.... we've had the Zen of Motorcycle Maintenance, How to build your house in F# or G, Bears philosophising about Hypophrygian modes, how to decanter a good chord sequence and "who needs theory when you're the Beatles and you've got George Martin" (a weak attempt to paraphrase Reiver). What more could you possible want? :-). Personally, I have the George Martin variation, a music therapist friend I can all any time and say.... "where's the lost chord in this sequence...?"


willem
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 8:13 am

Hello you all are,,good drivers,,coaches,constructors,wine lovers and i think good musicians,,i also think that you study it before you go to it.. practise,, driving,,coach,, construct,,and drink a good glas of wine,,the more you know the more you ..........................!


reiver
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 10:36 am

Some interesting responses to this post. Let me add to my previous posts by saying that I completely understand the advantages of learning the theory - but the question was will it make me a much better player. And I believe that the answer to this is no - knowing why we have to play an F chord doesn't make it easier to play.

I am not trying to bang the drum against learning theory - but we should understand why we are learning it. Working from the plans to build a house doesn't make me a bricklayer.

And finally, I hope.....


__m__ wrote:
First of all, my wife is a music teacher (BS in both music performance (horn) and music education working on masters), so she has some disdain for those who play but don't feel the need to learn theory.
I find this point of view a bit unfortunate and would try to encourage everyone out there, at whatever level of ability or knowledge of theory to continue to play the way that brings them the most enjoyment.

r


willem
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Thu Dec 03, 2009 11:10 am

willem wrote:
Hello you all are,,good drivers,,coaches,constructors,wine lovers and i think good musicians,,i also think that you study it before you go to it.. practise,, driving,,coach,, construct,,and drink a good glas of wine,,the more you know the more you ..........................!
the more you enjoy.!!!


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