Rhythm and Counting Time

tacticaltal
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 7:54 am

Preacher Shel, hahaha! :laugh: :P

Yeah, there is a song in there! :laugh: ;)

Anyway, start from scratch Terry. Watch the AGS from the beginning, watch those lessons and imagine that you need to teach it to someone else and how you would do that. I've done the exact same thing, trust me, you will exactly know what it is you're exactly doing. You'll get way more out of Neil's teaching and reviews if you know the basics. Or when I reply to an upload of yours, talking about swing time and 6/8, you'lll get what I mean! ;)

Come on, be patient and just listen carefully from the beginning, the puzzle will fall into place, and it's such a kick when you actually get it! :woohoo:

Ness

tacticaltal wrote:
nesh16041972 wrote:
What a great sermon Shel!! :cheer:

Where do you miss the boat Terry? Hmmmm.....i think you will know once you get ON the boat! :P

Come on, get on it and find out what it is you're exactly doing on that guitar, trust me, it'll be very interesting and it'll be way easier communicating with others when talking about playing the guitar! ;)

My two cents...

Ness
Oh, alright then, I will!! I've already told preacher Shel that I would. I think you two are in cahoots!! :D

I was headed to the dock, Ness, but I always end up at the damn airport :huh: (hmm, is there a song in there somewhere?)

Oh, I often wonder just what the hell I'm doing with that guitar in my hand. :D

OK, now to be serious. Where do I start? I mean, there's a bunch of info Neil has provided that I'm really interested in, such as general theory involving scales, all these terms that seemed to escape my young mind such as pentatonic, major, minor scales,chromatic AND NOW, reading sheet music.


unclewalt
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:00 pm

My thing is that I understand rhythm intellectually (sort of - obviously not completely, as you'll see in a moment), and I also have natural rhythm. But I can't put the two together. Like, I'll hear a song that I know is in 3/4, but to me, it could still be in 4/4, like one-and-uh, two-and-uh, three-and-u four-and-uh -- where the "and-uhs" are actually the 2 and the 3.

For example, with The Who's "Music Must Change." I can hear it in 3/4 (or is it 6/8 - this confuses me, too - are they equivalent, just using eighths instead of quarters?) but I can also hear it like this:


(1)DEEP in the (2)BACK of my (3)MIND is an un(4)REalized (1)SOUND......




.


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daryl
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:46 pm

I hear: 1-trip-let 2-trip-let 3-trip-let 4-trip-let

I'll wait for the experts to pronounce the correct time signature......


dennisg
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 2:01 pm

Seems pretty clearly 4/4 to me. Just follow John Entwistle's bass line.


suziko
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 2:16 pm

Huh... I hear what you're saying. It's hard for me to count, too. Though Wiki claims it's in 6/8 time:

Moon's health was especially an object of concern, as he only managed to come in during the last few weeks of recording and was unable to play in 6/8 time on the track "Music Must Change", so drums were removed completely from the track and only a few cymbal crashes were added


dennisg
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 2:23 pm

suziko wrote:
Huh... I hear what you're saying. It's hard for me to count, too. Though Wiki claims it's in 6/8 time:

Moon's health was especially an object of concern, as he only managed to come in during the last few weeks of recording and was unable to play in 6/8 time on the track "Music Must Change", so drums were removed completely from the track and only a few cymbal crashes were added
It's funny, Sue, I can count it out in both time signatures, although I suspect that Wiki is right about it being in 6/8.


dtaylor
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 3:29 pm

Well, you can write down music in different timesignatures, it actually sometimes depends on which sheetmusic you're using.

However, for a drummer this would particularly be a bluespattern, kick on the first and snare on the fourth beat, in 6/8 that is.

So yeah, i go for the 6/8! :P

Ness


thereshopeyet
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 5:13 pm

This is a cool topic.
I understand the theory:-

3/4 = 3 Quarter Notes in a measure.

6/8 = 6 Eighth Notes in a measure.

When seeking to hear the difference....... I noticed that many instructors refer to the song
Link: America - from Westside Story which alternates 3/4 and 6/8 measures.

I also came across the attached PDF (via Google) that I've yet to look at but others may be interested to have a look too.

http://www.totallyguitars.com/images/fb ... merica.zip



michelew
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 6:15 pm

dennisg wrote:
Seems pretty clearly 4/4 to me. Just follow John Entwistle's bass line.
Den - I think you're just counting a dotted quarter note (a group of three eigth notes) as a beat. So what you're counting as 1 bar of 4/4 is actually 2 bars of 6/8.

I learned the names of notes as minims, crotchets and quavers, etc. (English style I suspect). So the half, quarter, eight, sixteenth note thing always takes a micro second to translate in my brain. :)

Shel


dennisg
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Mon Dec 10, 2012 7:06 pm

michelew wrote:
dennisg wrote:
Seems pretty clearly 4/4 to me. Just follow John Entwistle's bass line.
Den - I think you're just counting a dotted quarter note (a group of three eigth notes) as a beat. So what you're counting as 1 bar of 4/4 is actually 2 bars of 6/8.

I learned the names of notes as minims, crotchets and quavers, etc. (English style I suspect). So the half, quarter, eight, sixteenth note thing always takes a micro second to translate in my brain. :)

Shel
I think you're probably right, Shel. Thanks for pointing that out.


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