Help me buy an electric-guitar amp

smips65
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Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:23 pm

dennisg wrote:
Stuart,

Funny you should mention this right now. I had bought a Line 6 Spider IV 30-watt amp, played with it for about a week and then returned it because it had a wonky power cord that kept disconnecting itself and also had an odd hum that would go away only when I touched the strings. It was an inexpensive amp, and all along I knew it was going to be an interim step -- a learning experience -- in my understanding of electric guitars. I thought about it for a week, then decided not to go back into the world of digital modeling amps. Instead, I ordered a little Bugera Vintage tube amp and a Digitech RP155 effects pedal. I won't always use the effects pedal with the amp -- and, to tell you the truth, I won't always use the amp with the effects pedal, since the pedal has a headphone jack. Anyway, in my quest to learn to walk before I run, this seems like a sane step #2. Thanks for asking.

The Bugera V-5 has a headphone out jack, and can also be plugged into a larger Cab later, when you need more volume. Just make sure you get a 4 ohm cab.

I agree with the note that the Fender 600 is a bit lame, nice clean amp for it's size, but not a lot of tweaking ability there. The Bug has onboard reverb which is nice for a small tube amp. I think you'll like it Dennis.

Just remember what I mentioned b4, it'll take a little bit before that speaker is broken in, so don't get surprised when it starts to change a little.


dennisg
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Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:35 pm

Update on the amp: I'm absolutely loving the sound that comes out of that little Bugera V5 amp. Since I'm new to electrics, I'd never paid any attention to tube vs. digital modeling amps, but there's a world of difference in the sound that even an idiot like me can perceive. You can get a beautiful clean tone out of it or add some gain to get as much crunch as you'd want. And the reverb sounds terrific.

By the way, don't sneer at a 5-watt amp. The thing can melt your face, and I'm not even using it at its highest power setting.

I just got my DigiTech RP155 guitar effects pedal last night, and I spent a couple of hours today figuring it out. The thing is amazing with all it does for $99. It's got something like 50 presets which you can easily edit and save. Plus it has about 30 drum loops, which I really enjoyed using today. It's amazing how much a little percussion adds to music.

So, total cost for the amp and guitar effects pedal: $250. The advice I've gotten in this thread: priceless.


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Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:31 pm

dennisg wrote:
Update on the amp: I'm absolutely loving the sound that comes out of that little Bugera V5 amp. Since I'm new to electrics, I'd never paid any attention to tube vs. digital modeling amps, but there's a world of difference in the sound that even an idiot like me can perceive. You can get a beautiful clean tone out of it or add some gain to get as much crunch as you'd want. And the reverb sounds terrific.

By the way, don't sneer at a 5-watt amp. The thing can melt your face, and I'm not even using it at its highest power setting.

I just got my DigiTech RP155 guitar effects pedal last night, and I spent a couple of hours today figuring it out. The thing is amazing with all it does for $99. It's got something like 50 presets which you can easily edit and save. Plus it has about 30 drum loops, which I really enjoyed using today. It's amazing how much a little percussion adds to music.

So, total cost for the amp and guitar effects pedal: $250. The advice I've gotten in this thread: priceless.
Dennis:

I have a Mesa Boogie Express 5:50 amp. It can be switched from 5 watts to 50 watts. You will hear no sneering from me about 5 watts. Loud as hell!!!!!!!!!! 50 watts will shatter all of my windows.....lol I purchased the RP350 a year or so ago, and I love it. That little gadget can keep you busy for a long time messing with different tones. Make sure you check Digitech's website for the sound patches there for download. You can dial in a certain tone and then save it and share it with others. There are tons of them for free downloading at their site (at least there were a few months ago - last time I checked in).

Have fun with the new toys.... B)

Jason


sws626
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Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:42 am

Hi Dennis,

I had a look and listen at the Bugera V5 along with several others in the same general category, including:

Blackheart BH5H (aka Little Giant)
Blackheart Killer Ant (1W variant of the BH5H)
Orange AD5 (aka Little Terror)
Blackstar HT5
Dr Z Mini Z
Fender Champ 600

Of these six amps, only the Bugera, Fender 600 and Blackhearts were really within my budget and all would require some modification for use in a home studio. As I mentioned earlier, the Fender is really not very nice at all. The Blackhearts seemed to lend themselves best to modification. Why is that important?

My concern was not that these wouldn't have enough power output, but rather that they would have way too much. To saturate the tubes enough to get any noticeable distortion, even with a 5W amp you still end up with volumes far higher than would be tolerated by our neighbours or my family. And since I often play at night after our daughter is in bed, this is a real issue. And even though some, like the Blackheart, have a 3W setting, this is still super loud. On the other end of the spectrum, the Killer Ant (which is actually somewhat


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Thu Apr 22, 2010 9:03 am

Stuart:

I can't find it right now, but I will try and dig it up...... I found an article a while back about a very simple mod, or maybe it was even a simple little gadget that would allow you to keep your class A output and crank the volume up on the amp to get the tone you want. Then you could use this little device to drop the volume and keep the tone where it was. Worked very slick, and I think it was about $80.00 - $120.00 for the whole get-up. Did not need to crack the case open to do it either. I though it was pretty slick.

Jason


sws626
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Thu Apr 22, 2010 9:37 am

Music Junkie wrote:
Stuart:

I can't find it right now, but I will try and dig it up...... I found an article a while back about a very simple mod, or maybe it was even a simple little gadget that would allow you to keep your class A output and crank the volume up on the amp to get the tone you want. Then you could use this little device to drop the volume and keep the tone where it was. Worked very slick, and I think it was about $80.00 - $120.00 for the whole get-up. Did not need to crack the case open to do it either. I though it was pretty slick.

Jason
Hi Jason,

That sounds interesting. I know there are several attenuator products you can connect externally. The mod I had done is based on a technique developed by a company called London Power. Here is their description:

London Power - Power Scaling

Although it did require opening up the chassis -- which I was going to have done anyway for other reasons -- by itself, this specific mod was in about the price range you mentioned.

-Stuart


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Thu Apr 22, 2010 10:40 am

Stuart:

The attenuator products you mentioned are what I was talking about. I had a link on my last laptop, but can't seem to find it on my new one.... :(

At any rate, it sounds like you have it figured out. I just think that it is a great mod. If you can get the gain and the master volume on the amp turned up high enough to get that specific tone you want, while at the same time being able to cut the output volume to reasonable levels, then that is a sweet feature.... B)

J


sws626
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Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:06 pm

Hi Jason,

I'm still waiting for my cabinet, so haven't hooked it all up yet, but I have high hopes for this.

WARNING: GEARHEAD CONTENT BELOW...

The arrangement I settled on actually provides two methods for scaling the power. You can either scale the output amp circuits, leaving the pre-amp unaffected or you can choose to scale the circuits of both the pre-amp and the output amp.

In addition to the power scaling, I've had the following changes made to the original Blackheart amp, some of which were just for convenience and others I'm not sure will make much difference, but didn't add anything significant to the cost, so I thought maybe worth a try:

- The original has a single EL84 output tube made in China. This has been replaced with a higher quality JJ EL84 and supplemented by a second Sino 6L6GC tube. You can switch between them on the fly to get a different sort of sound.

- Likewise, the original 12AX7 preamp tube has been replaced with a JJ ECC83.

- Alongside the original solid state rectifier, a Sovtek 5Y3GT tube rectifier has been added and you can switch between them on the fly.

- The original output transformer has been replaced by a Hammond 124DSE transformer.

- A switch has been added to bypass the tone control, which otherwise tends to limit the preamp gain.

- A 3-way pre-amp bias switch has been added to select how the speaker output signal is fed back into the amp circuit and thus how clean or crunchy the sound.

- Separate line level output and headphone sockets have been added. They take their signal from the output transformer and can be used with or without speakers. The headphone socket mutes the speaker output when used.

- Separate controls have been added to independently adjust the gain of the preamp and power amp. Originally, the amp lacked any sort of "master" control.

- Standby switch added -- the original was either "on" or "off."

- A bit of rewiring was done to remove some buzz and hum.

- All the capacitors have been replaced.

I know this sounds like a lot of work to do on a already pretty fine amp and it added another $200 onto the cost of a $200 amp. But I couldn't stop myself and it still seems like a good value when you look at the alternatives.

I'll post some samples when its all set up and running. Maybe by then I'll also have picked up the ES-335.

-Stuart


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Thu Apr 22, 2010 1:16 pm

Stuart:

Good move on replacing the Chinese made EL84's.......

My personal preference would be to0 leave the pre-amp alone, but for no other reason than a personal preference.....

A tube amp with a headphone outlet?????? That is a rarity..... I was looking for that option, but was having a hard time and finally gave up...... :(

Standby switches are great. My Mesa boogie has one and I love it. It is nice to put it on standby and let the tubes warm up a little before sticking it to em'..... B)

Someday, when I am rich and money is no concern (not holding my breath), I am going to plop down some cash on a Bogner amp. The dude knows his stuff and his Shiva and Duende amps provide some amazing tone all by themselves with no effects other than the reverb. Super sparkling cleans akin to the Fender Twin of old and crunch enough to satisfy and meatal head who spouts nothing but Marshall...... Course the price tag reflects this at roughly $3,000.00..... :(

A guy can dream though. Here is a link to their site and there are some sound samples to listen too. Only a smidgen of what they will give you tone wise....

http://www.bogneramplification.com/cust ... rsInfo.php

They also partnered up with Line 6 for the Spider Valve, which was a bit strange, to have an all tube pre-amp with modeling..... Messed with one at my local store though and it was very fun..... :)

Jason


smips65
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Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:40 pm

sws626 wrote:
Hi Jason,

I'm still waiting for my cabinet, so haven't hooked it all up yet, but I have high hopes for this.

WARNING: GEARHEAD CONTENT BELOW...

The arrangement I settled on actually provides two methods for scaling the power. You can either scale the output amp circuits, leaving the pre-amp unaffected or you can choose to scale the circuits of both the pre-amp and the output amp.

In addition to the power scaling, I've had the following changes made to the original Blackheart amp, some of which were just for convenience and others I'm not sure will make much difference, but didn't add anything significant to the cost, so I thought maybe worth a try:

- The original has a single EL84 output tube made in China. This has been replaced with a higher quality JJ EL84 and supplemented by a second Sino 6L6GC tube. You can switch between them on the fly to get a different sort of sound.

- Likewise, the original 12AX7 preamp tube has been replaced with a JJ ECC83.

- Alongside the original solid state rectifier, a Sovtek 5Y3GT tube rectifier has been added and you can switch between them on the fly.

- The original output transformer has been replaced by a Hammond 124DSE transformer.

- A switch has been added to bypass the tone control, which otherwise tends to limit the preamp gain.

- A 3-way pre-amp bias switch has been added to select how the speaker output signal is fed back into the amp circuit and thus how clean or crunchy the sound.

- Separate line level output and headphone sockets have been added. They take their signal from the output transformer and can be used with or without speakers. The headphone socket mutes the speaker output when used.

- Separate controls have been added to independently adjust the gain of the preamp and power amp. Originally, the amp lacked any sort of "master" control.

- Standby switch added -- the original was either "on" or "off."

- A bit of rewiring was done to remove some buzz and hum.

- All the capacitors have been replaced.

I know this sounds like a lot of work to do on a already pretty fine amp and it added another $200 onto the cost of a $200 amp. But I couldn't stop myself and it still seems like a good value when you look at the alternatives.

I'll post some samples when its all set up and running. Maybe by then I'll also have picked up the ES-335.

-Stuart


OK, I'll admit, I'm a gear head as well.... :blush:


Good move with the tube switch.

And for the newbs, swapping tubes on the fly takes practice, never with bare fingers.

The Bug that Dennis bought has a lot of nice features, and having one myself, I wholeheartedly support the purchase. The Bug has a 0.1/1/5 power output, headphone, reverb, and cab output built-in. No aftermarket mods required, except of course for the tubes. For $150.00, I wouldn't put that much more into it for caps, and point to point wiring.

The whole idea on this thread was for Dennis to learn what he wants as far as sound, and tone, and all that good stuff. Didn't want a headdunk Baptisem in the deep end of the pool, and divert his attention too much towards electronics, and glass tubes, and so on and so forth. After all he has a knock-out guitar to learn with.


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