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So there I am tuning down to an alternate tuning, as I often like to do, and I am already tuned down a little as I am in A=432Hz mode (about 1/3rd of a half step down from standard A=440Hz tuning) and ping! there goes my high E string! And I'm on Crete without a spare set of strings as my supplier failed to deliver my pre-holiday order on time. Oops! No guitar shops anywhere near and the only place I know I can get strings is a 2 .5 hour drive away on the other side of the island. Luckily Corina is arriving next day and can bring a spare set of Martin Lights. So saved, except for the fact I mess up the re-string and put a kink in the E string as I'm winding it and.... sure enough it breaks! Leaving me about 1.5 cm of string longer that the distance bridge to machine head. That's just not gonna work, is it? Well, somehow it did and with the E string hanging on for dear life (goodness knows how I managed to string it, I was desperate!) I was able to play 10 days straight with no problem.... except I did not dare re-tune the guitar to alternate tunings. So Corina and I were able to get through the list of songs below playing every day for ourselves and Miss Ale and sometimes for fellow tourists.

It was Miss Ale's Seagull I took with us as Agean Airlines does not let you take your guitar in a gigbag into the cabin.... unless you would kindly like to buy another seat!! Unlike Swiss which allows guitars in the cabin free. That required me to buy a case, so I went for a Hiscox which was perfect and travels went well, no guitar problems at all, the airline did treat it with enough TLC.

My question is: Why the heck is the E string breaking on a tune down move when it is already under less stress that normal. Its happened to me several times over the years and I don't get it. Is it a light gauge problem? Any suggestions on how to avoid this in future?

Songs played on Crete this October. Unfortunately we did not video or record anything. Not sure why! Probably ouzo related! A merry time was had by all :

Simple Game - Moodies
Eyes of a Child - Moodies
Emely’s Song - Moodies
If You Read My Mind - Lightfoot
Rain - Feliciano
Scarborough Faire - S&G
Nights in White Satin - Moodies
I’ll be Back - Beatles
Don’t Let The Sun Go Down on Me - Elton
While My Guitar Gently Weeps - Harrison
Yesterday - Beatles
Mrs. Robinson - S&G
Sound of Silence -S&G
Angels - Robbie Williams
Killing me Softly - Roberta Flack
Big Yellow Taxi - Joni Mitchell
The Reach - Fogelberg
New Horizons - Moodies
The Boxer - S&G
Gypsy - Moodies
Bye, Bye Love - Everly Brothers
Story in Your Eyes - Moodies
Year of The Cat - Al Stewart
The Actor- Moodies
25 or 6 to 4 - Chicago
Cotton Jenny - Lightfoot
Never Too Close - Lightfoot
Whatever’s Written in Your Heart - Gerry Rafferty
Elenor Rigby - Beatles
Tuesday Afternoon - Moodies
Country Roads - Denver
Leaving on a Jet Plane - Denver
Stones - Neil Diamond
Summer Wine - Hazelwood/Sinatra
House of The Rising Sun - Animals
Raining on the Rock - Johnny Williamson
Norwegian Wood - Beatles
Windmills of Your Mind -Bergman/Le Grand

So to make up for lack of video I made a quick compilation of some photos on Crete and around Lake Zürich on return home to catch the autumn mood. Crete is fabulous for shopping for jewellery, art, pottery and olive wood items and there are many local artists making lovely stuff, so you will see some of the swag and gifts in the video along with a Seagull at the beach , a fire in the mountains and some lovely girls . Also a full moon through a gap in the restaurant wall next to Miss Ale's head in a spooky pic.... and a Freudian slip in the lyrics of Windmills of your Mind, who can spot it? So, a holiday picture postcard to music....

I haven't watched the video yet. I'm looking forward to it, but I'm just quickly waiting in the coffee queue now. I'll savor it later.

Re the high-e string. My guess is that reducing the tension on the low E allows the neck to flex back to be straighter (a little of course), the neck in effect twists a little and then because you haven't also reduced the tension on the high strings yet it ends up taking the extra strain and gets overstretched to breaking point because it can't stretch fast enough; presumably these are older strings too and they're somewhat fatigued.


Let's see what Dan says of course. Perhaps you need to reduce the tension across all of the strings a bit at a time, or even starting with the high strings rather than the low ones next time.


The image of the video is a beautiful one. Two sweet souls in paradise.

M

Hi Shel, I did start with the high E........ I just looked at it and Ping!

neverfoundthetime wrote:

Hi Shel, I did start with the high E........ I just looked at it and Ping!

Perhaps you should turn off your high-frequency laser vision, first! next time. :p

Thanks for the video. Some beautiful photos of the three of you especially; lovely company in soul lifting surrounds. You can feel the temperature shift from here as you start showing Autumn in Zurich; beautiful none the less.

E-string - after reading your question above in closer detail, perhaps it's your stringing technique combined with the characteristics of light strings themselves; being thinner, they may be more brittle initially. Perhaps you need to find an approach that's better suited to light strings. I'm guessing you've already worked that one out for yourself.

Thanks for sharing your trip with us. And that's SOME list of songs. Wooooeee! I'm envious.

Shel

Hi Chris,
With regard to the same string breaking all the time...I would closely examine the tuner post to see if there is a small burr or sharp edge that is nicking the string and causing it to break. I can't remember the last time I broke the high E string. It could also be the brand of strings you are buying. Have you tried Elixir Nanowebs or John Pearse or even Martin Lifespan? They are all good strings. When you say light, what do you mean? Anything lighter than .012 gauge could be the problem. I'd be interested to hear what you find.

Bill

PS. You might also check your winding technique. I use the Martin Guitar method taught by Dave Doll at C.F. Martin:

Thanks Bill, that's an update version of one I have seen before. No work bench with me on Crete (in fact I own no tools at all, I'm not much of a handiman!) so I was a little sloppy on the hi E re-string, which is why it got a knick in it and then broke. I understand how being sloppy on stringing breaks strings but still don't get why tuning down on an E string not under too much tension can break as soon as you touch it. Its happened on a B string too (different guitar)and on the octave G string on my 12 (easy to do!), so maybe 3 times in all the years I've been playing. I do change a lot of strings! This was on my daughter's Seagull, not my BSG. Posts all clean. The original string was an D'Addario light 0.12.

Yes Michele, wonderful energies in a wonderful place with wonderful people! And it was interesting to log all the songs we did, we started to notice it was quiet some set! Still adding more as Corina and I get to sing more together. If Ness was there it would be a way longer list, for sure!! We'll work on that.

Yes we sure had a lovely time again at Crete.
And indeed...we didn't record any songs this time... maybe because our very talented " video guy" Lucas, (Larry has some competition! ) didn't come along this time...
:laugh:

I'm glad we do have some very nice photos to show and Chris has recorded a beautiful song to accompany these, to give all our friends at TG an impression.
Next musical impression will most likely come from a much colder, but still as gorgeous environment as Crete is, and again with heartwarming and musically inspiring company...


Corina.

Ps I know the freudian slip you made in the song! (with a little help)
Let's see if others can pick it out...
:silly:

neverfoundthetime wrote:

Thanks Bill, that's an update version of one I have seen before. No work bench with me on Crete (in fact I own no tools at all, I'm not much of a handiman!) so I was a little sloppy on the hi E re-string, which is why it got a knick in it and then broke. I understand how being sloppy on stringing breaks strings but still don't get why tuning down on an E string not under too much tension can break as soon as you touch it. Its happened on a B string too (different guitar)and on the octave G string on my 12 (easy to do!), so maybe 3 times in all the years I've been playing. I do change a lot of strings! This was on my daughter's Seagull, not my BSG. Posts all clean. The original string was an D'Addario light 0.12.

Yes Michele, wonderful energies in a wonderful place with wonderful people! And it was interesting to log all the songs we did, we started to notice it was quiet some set! Still adding more as Corina and I get to sing more together. If Ness was there it would be a way longer list, for sure!! We'll work on that.

Hi Chris,
One more suggestion with regard to de-tuning a string. This may or may not be the answer/answers:
I've read some reviews on D'Addario strings that speak of breakage problems. Seems there may have been some bad batches. Also Seagull guitars have their head stock set up so there is no bend or offset in the string over the nut. The tuners are in line with the corresponding slots in the nut, so it may be possible that lack of a "break" in the string angle coupled with some defective strings may be the problem. In other words, guitars with a break in the string angle have tension relief at the nut, while Seagulls have equal tension from the tuner all the way to the bridge pin. I'm just guessing here but it could be the reason you're having the breakage problem.

I'd be willing to bet Wiley has some ideas about this.

Bill