On The Beat - Episode 386 - Weekly Guitar Video News Wrap Up August 18th, 2017

davidrfinn99165
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:04 am

My two penn'orth..

Neil - i support your philosophy, enjoy your teaching, and appreciate your lessons. I welcome your return to posting regular new lessons...eg the recent Poirot theme. I also enjoy both Ness and Max's lessons, but your own contributions , teaching technical and challenging acoustic pieces, are appreciated and must surely be part of the ongoing TG offer. More please.

I agree entirely with Bill on fret markers. This seems to me so blindingly obvious and i am surprised it wasn't accepted immediately. Trying to rationalise it away by saying students don't need it, shouldn't need it, bill himself doesn't need it, or we can always pause the videos..is avoiding the central teaching point which Bill was making. Students learn in different ways, the internet is a visual medium..etc. I find fret markers are immensely useful when trying to learn pieces with eg complex jazz chords and inversions up past the 5th or 7th frets . I kind of assumed that was what they were there for, ..we are not learning the blasted violin!

that may have been four penn'orth/ david


wrsomers
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:48 am

davidrfinn99165 wrote:
My two penn'orth..

Neil - i support your philosophy, enjoy your teaching, and appreciate your lessons. I welcome your return to posting regular new lessons...eg the recent Poirot theme. I also enjoy both Ness and Max's lessons, but your own contributions , teaching technical and challenging acoustic pieces, are appreciated and must surely be part of the ongoing TG offer. More please.

I agree entirely with Bill on fret markers. This seems to me so blindingly obvious and i am surprised it wasn't accepted immediately. Trying to rationalise it away by saying students don't need it, shouldn't need it, bill himself doesn't need it, or we can always pause the videos..is avoiding the central teaching point which Bill was making. Students learn in different ways, the internet is a visual medium..etc. I find fret markers are immensely useful when trying to learn pieces with eg complex jazz chords and inversions up past the 5th or 7th frets . I kind of assumed that was what they were there for, ..we are not learning the basted violin!

that may have been four penn'orth/ david
Thank you David. Finally someone dares to speak up besides me.

Yes Neil, I still think you are a good teacher, but we all can benefit by listening to other people's requests for improving communication and improving the learning experience. As you may recall, I am a professional golf teacher and know that everyone learns differently. In order to be successful, a teacher (of whatever subject) must try to reach each student in the way he/she learns best. Be it verbal, visual, or written, etc. I understand that your task is difficult because you don't get the feedback from your unseen students to determine how they learn. So I would suggest that you take seriously, their suggestions about how you can help the requesting individual progress at their own given speed and method.

And finally, yes Michele, the straw that broke the camel's back was being publicly laughed at by two people who I once (and hope to again) respect. My initial reaction was to laugh too, but the more I thought about it (and watched the video) the more upset I became. I was serious in my observation that fret markers would make things easier, and I what I got instead was chiding and derision because I'm not "a real student". Call me sensitive, but that's the way I feel. Especially in a place (TG) where a premium is placed on being nice and never critical.

Bill


TGNesh
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:03 am

I'm sorry you feel that way Bill. In thruth, i was in fact making fun of Neil's guitar, not you. It was just a joke.

If that has caused to lose your respect for me, then I'm sorry for that.

wrsomers wrote:
davidrfinn99165 wrote:
My two penn'orth..

Neil - i support your philosophy, enjoy your teaching, and appreciate your lessons. I welcome your return to posting regular new lessons...eg the recent Poirot theme. I also enjoy both Ness and Max's lessons, but your own contributions , teaching technical and challenging acoustic pieces, are appreciated and must surely be part of the ongoing TG offer. More please.

I agree entirely with Bill on fret markers. This seems to me so blindingly obvious and i am surprised it wasn't accepted immediately. Trying to rationalise it away by saying students don't need it, shouldn't need it, bill himself doesn't need it, or we can always pause the videos..is avoiding the central teaching point which Bill was making. Students learn in different ways, the internet is a visual medium..etc. I find fret markers are immensely useful when trying to learn pieces with eg complex jazz chords and inversions up past the 5th or 7th frets . I kind of assumed that was what they were there for, ..we are not learning the basted violin!

that may have been four penn'orth/ david


And finally, yes Michele, the straw that broke the camel's back was being publicly laughed at by two people who I once (and hope to again) respect.
Bill


wrsomers
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:14 am

TGVanessa wrote:
I'm sorry you feel that way Bill. In thruth, i was in fact making fun of Neil's guitar, not you. It was just a joke.

If that has caused to lose your respect for me, then I'm sorry for that.
Ness,
I'm sorry too, and I will get over it. But please, don't try to un-ring the bell. You said what you said and it seemed pretty clear to me that the "joke" was directed at me and not Neil's guitar. And the "it was just a joke" excuse is always lame.

Peace,
Bill


thereshopeyet
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:17 am

Bill

This topic came up way back at the beginning of TG and we got the same answer, NO ! :(
I'd like fret markers too.
I find I pause and count the frets sometimes.

The problem with counting frets though....... there isn't a "Counting Fret's Lesson" :S :blush: :S

I don't FRET about it any more but it's the primary reason I'm off tune !!

:laugh: :laugh:


spinland
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:42 am

I'll only chime in because I was asked to (in a general sense).

I have zero complaints about the teaching style of the folks here; none. The engaging demeanors, the thoroughness and quality of the information, the clarity and expertise of the demonstrations...I said it at Camp and I'll say it again: I feel like I'm at home in many ways. I do find navigating the site itself rather clunky at times, and some of the features don't work as advertised, but then again you guys are musicians and not web developers and I know your focus is on creating the content, not finessing delivering it. I can always find what I'm looking for, so it's all good.

Fret markers? Honestly until the issue was raised I had not seen their lack as an obstacle. I get that everyone is different; in my personal case it's a non-issue.

That's all I feel I need add. Have a rocking week! :side:

Mark


unclewalt
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:28 pm

You're a great teacher, Neil, but your refusal to use a guitar with fret markers for video lessons is still a mystery to me. Unless you have some argument for why not using one is somehow helpful. So far, I haven't seen you present such an argument, but only declare that you just don't wanna, for whatever reason.

Of course your job isn't really to make it "easier" to learn the guitar (it's hard!). But this seems to be an unnecessary *impediment* to learning. It detracts from the lesson when a student has to try to figure out what fret you're on, and gets lost. Low on the neck, it's not a problem, but once you're up around the 7th fret or so, it's confusing, even for an "advanced" (well, sort-of) player like myself.

And I know you were sort-of joking with the "real students" crack -- but as far as I can tell, that's your real take on the matter. Again, if you can explain why this practice is actually *helpful* to students, I'm all ears.


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neverfoundthetime
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:55 pm

I have been teaching (sport) for 40 years now and have been lucky enough to have been exposed to some fantastic mentors and educators during this time and I have often been surrounded by excellence. One of my classmates and peers has been Knighted by the Queen, another became a Lord and another is an honored member of The Royal Society (of Science). However, obviously, non of it rubbed off on me :laugh: . I think I know excellence when I see it by now and I saw it instantly in Neil and have seen it develop with Ness as she has grown into her role as a TG Teacher. Max is obviously very good too. I've met Dave Nachmanoff and Jim Bruno and have seen enough of them and Doug Young to know this is a group of musicians and educators of the highest quality. So the teaching at TG is stellar.

I absolutely identify with Neil when he says,

"My goal is to challenge students to become the best they can, which usually would get them to a point where they are better than they thought they could be
.... my goal as a teacher is to keep improving, and I rarely give a lesson where I don't get new insight into teaching."

I love to be challenged because I know he is right in doing so. And a challenge from Neil can be a pretty provocative and powerful thing at times, nothing for the weak-hearted! :laugh: There is much wisdom in his ways and Neil's depth of knowledge is simply astounding and he is a man with a big heart.

So am I bothered much by missing fret-markers or the occasional ramble around the block? :laugh: Nope. Yes, I'd like to see fret-markers if given the choice and I like my showers warm and to park in the shade :laugh: . But before I question anything Neil does or says, I'm going to have a long look at myself first.

One thing which is absolutely out of order and totally uncalled for on this site, or on YT or FB for that matter, is dissing any of the teachers or being disrespectful in tone and manner, whatever the point is one may like to make or whatever the beef. I'm sure there is fault to be found often enough at TG but its a question of balance (couldn't resist that :) ) and perspective. The ratio of wonderful to irritations here is massively positive. I can't even begin to list the things I thank TG for!

Bill, obviously you have a thin skin at times, I hope you get over it. We all need to be able to laugh at ourselves. I checked the video and Vanessa made a jibe at Neil for resisting fret-markers that you have wished for. There is no crime here, these are not mean-spirited people. As for speaking up on the forum Bill, if you'd been around during the first few years you would have seen there has never been a lack of that! :laugh: There still isn't. Being critical is good, being nice is common decency.

Dave, don't be such a wuss, get yourself a violin :laugh: .

Walt, you make a good point, does Neil have some actual scientific basis for his Fret-marker phobia? We await with baited breath! :laugh:

Peace and love. :)


thereshopeyet
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:46 pm

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wrsomers
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Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:01 pm

thereshopeyet wrote:
Image
Thank you Dermot and Uncle Walt! B) . Now I don’t feel so Moody and Blue. ;) .


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