Collaborations - Just keep getting better

tovo
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Sat Mar 20, 2010 3:21 pm

Hi guys,

I really wanted to make a point regarding the collaborations and didn't want to hijack Mark and Damian's wonderful thread.

A few people have commented that Mark and Damian's is the "best collaboration ever" and I don't think many would disagree, I certainly don't. But it was never intended to be a competition in my mind (nor theirs I would imagine although I can't speak for them).

I'm not trying to be heavy, it just concerns me that this might be seen as a competition. My intention when I suggested this was to encourage more people to get involved, not scare people away because they think "gee I could never top that". That's not the aim.

We are all at different levels of progression. Everyone who puts themselves out there is showing a lot of chutzpah.

What I do think is really worthy of note is how quickly everyone has grasped and improved the technology. Really impressive.

All that said, top effort by the lads. I like everyone think it's great.


goldleaf
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Sat Mar 20, 2010 3:43 pm

Tovo, well said and I agree. A very important point. I believe many members have started to sing along with their playing, something some said they would just never do, but since others were doing it and getting support they finally tried it and bingo, a new singer was born. Same with the collaborations, I think it is important that we always try to encourage members to try new things to them, some are better at the tech kind of stuff and can lead the way for the rest of us as long as they don't feel as though they will be judged as it is a competition. We do have competitions going now and they are great also. I just wanted to agree with you because, I got that feeling of WOW how am I going to compete with that, the answer is I'm not if it is a competition. So again thanks to you for being the first to introduce the idea and to point out that we should keep it in a manner of encouraging everyone who is interested to try their own thing without being concerned about how it compares to others submissions. Gary


dennisg
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Sat Mar 20, 2010 3:52 pm

Tony,

I'm glad you started this thread because I'm very much opposed to comparing anyone's effort to anyone else's. To be honest, I'm not particularly interested that someone is of the opinion that Mark's and Damian's collaboration is the best one ever ... or the worst one. That kind of comparison is of zero value and only serves to diminish the wonderful efforts other people put into their work. We should be encouraging people to post videos by offering support and suggestions, not comparisons to other people.


MarkM
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Sat Mar 20, 2010 4:15 pm

I completely agree with what Tony said. Let me stress that this was never about any competition. Heck I haven't particpated in any of the real site sanctioned competitions. Not that those are not a great idea because they are. I just haven't had the time. This little idea at the time started out with me really likeing this song (** Story at the bottom) and having met Damian out in Las Vegas I thought about doing something like this with him. I had seen all the great collaborations that had happened. Tony and the gang with Heart of Gold, Al and Chris, Tammy and Jay, etc.... I was a bit afraid at first but then with all the folks singing on the site I would give it a try with some less than successful test balloons. :laugh: :laugh: I got all of this great support on this site to help me get a bit out of my shell. That was such a help you'll never know. So we had this idea in our heads that we would have 4 inputs. 1 of each of us singing and the other two would be one of each of us playing. One thing led to another and it ended up like this. I'm happy people like all the tech stuff about it but speaking for myself (I'm sure Damian agrees) it was really just about the playing. If you strip everything else away I wanted to make sure that we were getting the song right. It has two guitar parts in it and that is really what we were trying to showcase. Taking a lesson that Neil had on the site and then adding to it a bit in a musical sense. Everything else, the tech stuff, is just a cool bonus that we had at our disposal. So again I want to state that I agree with Tony on this.


** Ok if you still want to read here is a bit of a back story on this song for me. Growing up I had always been a Beatles fan. Huge fan. So one day when a buddy of mine and I were in Key West Florida for a fishing vacation (about 15 years ago)that evening we hit Duval street. It's THE street in Key West. Countless bars up and down the road. So midway through the evening we walk not so gracefully over to Captain Tony's (the bar that Jimmy Buffett mentions in a few of his songs) to have a few more adult beverages. While we are there we were listening to this couple, guy and women, playing on acoustic guitars. They were the entertainment of the evening. Well this bar is pretty much open air. Meaning that all the walls facing the street aren't walls at all. It's all open. So after a few more drinks I got up enough nerve to ask for a request. Two of Us. They looked at me and then each other as they tried to figure out the song. Well the smart ass women says to me. OK we'll play it but you have to whistle the part at the end and handed me a mic. Well since I had two drinks in my hand I handed my buddy one and grabbed the mic. I mean how hard could this be anyway. All I had to do was whistle. Well they played the song pretty well from what I can remember and then then ending comes and here is my big moment. Well lets just say the brain was willing but the lips couldn't pucker to even get the smallest whistle out. Note to self is that when one drinks to much one can't whistle. I got a rousing applause and much laughter at my expense. My buddy still tells this story at least once a year with friends. So thats my story. When I saw that Neil put this song up for a lesson I jumped all over it.



MarkM


tovo
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Sat Mar 20, 2010 4:26 pm

Thanks for commenting guys. I also want to make it real clear I'm not taking a swipe at anyone. I just think it's worth noting. Cool story by the way Mark. Could be a good thread..embarrassing Karaoke performances.


goldleaf
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Sat Mar 20, 2010 4:32 pm

Mark, that is a great story, almost as good as your song, I laughed my rear off as I read it, since I had a somewhat similar event trying to whistle while a little tipsy at a Christmas party. Gary


Chasplaya
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Sat Mar 20, 2010 5:00 pm

Don't know that anyone has thought of it as being competitive... yet. What interests me is the ever increasing advances being made and the showcase of whats available for people to use. If anything to date its encouraging others to go where they have never been before. As for myself, my technical abilities are fairly limited with audio and video, but to see what can be done is fantastic , I know my efforts won't measure up technically for a while , it will be pure me and my little samsung camera and either MM or AVS. However,it does encourage me to actually use some of the software I have had on my PC for years, Guitar Rig 3.0 and Soundforge 9.0. I am also considering downloading Audacity as it may be easier to use. If it weren't for these collaborations some of us would still be in the dark about whats possible. So hopefully guys don't get intimidated and think 'can't compete' as Tony rightly says thats not the aim or what its all about. I think some of the comments re MarkM and D_Dog's video are aimed primarilly at the tech side of the collaboration, and maybe more should have been said about the actual song. The work that Damian put in is commendable and the fact he went on in another thread explaining step by step and sharing how it was achieved now thats great stuff totally unselfish and in keeping with the site. I think we need to keep in mind that not everyone is a tech guru and comment accordingly. This video certainly raised the technical bar and showcased whats possible, importantly I think we need to be careful in comparing musical abilities with one another but look more at how individuals progress and I'm not sure we really did that sufficiently to be fair.

Good thread Tony and very worthy of discusion.


d_dog
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Sat Mar 20, 2010 8:30 pm

Most excellent thread Tony. I couldn't agree more with your points. And Marks, I feel the same way he does. The thought that these collaboration posts were some type of one-upsmanship, never crossed my mind. I can say that for certainty, because I have a tiny ego, it's not the way I think. Mark and I just played and sang the song to the best of our ability, and I did the things I know how to do, to the best of my ability, why would anyone do any less?

If there is anyone out there reading this that is going to think twice about posting a video or a collaboration because you think there are better ones out there, and you could never do that good, I'm gonna to kick your ass! :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: ;) ;) Of course kidding, but do you think John Lennon or Paul McCartney should have given up if they thought the Rolling Stones were better than them? Or maybe Jimmy Page should have given up because maybe he thought that Clapton was better than him? Or maybe I should have given up years ago when I was learning all this stuff, because I thought others were better than me? Hell no!!! I would feel absolutely terrible if this causes anyone to think twice about posting anything, that would be very sad and absolutely not our intentions. Please I implore you, if you think someone or something is better than you're capable of, then strive for that, practice, get better, or better yet, BE DIFFERENT! It's all subjective opinion anyway.

As Tony so aptly puts it, those of you that have the Chutzpah to post a video or wants to do a collaboration, but just can't get the technical part down, please, please ask me or some of the other techies. I would love to help and teach anyone everything I know so that you'll feel comfortable in doing so. I am no better than anyone, I took the time to learn what I wanted to learn and no doubt there was someone, just like those on this website, that I thought were better than me, and they were willing to teach me along the way. I want to pay it forward.

Dang, now I am sounding like this is about me, no it's not. Just wanted to offer my help, that's all. :) :) :)

Thanks Tony for the thread, great topic.


haoli25
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Sat Mar 20, 2010 8:36 pm

As usual, that green guy from Oz is right on the money. I hope the collaborations continue to be about, "Sharing The Gift" rather than a competition. What we have here at TG is too good to screw up.



Bill


tovo
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Sat Mar 20, 2010 9:01 pm

A few of my mates here on TG reckon I spend way to much time apologising/justifying/worrying/wringing my hands and gnashing my teeth...all that stuff.

They are right.

I'm glad we appear to share a common view on this. I'd hate to see this terrific sense of community and the vibe of support and encouragement disappear. Looks like I have nothing to worry about.


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