Busking The Eagles: Peaceful, Easy Feeling

wrsomers
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Sat Apr 29, 2017 8:05 pm

Mark,
I didn't mean to imply anything regarding the A shape barre and, all creds to you for having no trouble with that shape. I struggle with it especially in Bb or B. Anyway, I want to thank you for the info you've imparted, especially the Glen Frye video. It really clears up a lot. I recommended Neil's version because of the bass strings. But now I see that when played in drop D tuning it really works quite well.

I love the drop D and then the G6 add 5 ??? (I think)...open 6th string, B on 5th string, open 4th, 3rd and 1st strings and D on the second string. The 1st string could be fretted at the 3rd fret too.

And thanks to Bart for spotting that he plays another G chord up the neck at the 5th position (strings 5&6 with string 1 at fret 3). I really like that voicing and will be using it from now on.

Bill


spinland
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Sat Apr 29, 2017 8:12 pm

It's all good, Bill, no worries!

To be honest? I didn't really understand why someone as gifted (and experienced) as Glenn Frey might capo that to D, but with Bart's input about the drop D tuning it makes a lot more sense to me, as well.

Now I want to go back and revisit that song using drop D and experiment with voicings. In my copious spare time. :dry:

Heh.

I love this stuff! :side:

Mark


wrsomers
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Sat Apr 29, 2017 8:22 pm

Thanks Mark,
Go back and re-read my above post, I edited it regarding that first G chord. Cool stuff.

Bill


TGNesh
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Sun Apr 30, 2017 4:32 am

Hey Mark, I would say great improvement there for sure!

I do wanna chime in on the conversation regarding relative key, absolute key, voicings and 'up and down' the neck.

I find it a very important skill, the ability to communicate about music. So expressing whatever you're talking about is important. Whenever someone else is involved, like a fellow musician or student/teacher, you just have to. Otherwise it takes an awful lot of time and at one point frustration.

And actually you didn't mis-spoke at all. You said it quite right. Neil and I teach it all over the place, in the guitarworld you think/talk in shapes no matter if you're using a capo or not. If you do use a capo anywhere on the neck, the shape remains the same and for that the key and chords we think in remain the same as well. That's why we say 'relative to the capo'.

And then there is of course the absolute key (the actual key if you will), which is in general only important when you're playing with a bassplayer/pianoplayer etc.. And even then, you could say, 'I'm in the key of D, capo II'. The other musician would get that for him/her the key would be 2 half steps up. So George Harrison plays Here Comes The Sun in the key of D, period. Yes, capoed on the 7th fret is an important detail of course. :laugh:

So in the scheme of things, to have all musicians play in the same absolute key, where you place the capo is important, except of course when you're playing by yourself, which is often the case. (I agree with whoever said 'Thank God for capoes' :P ). Don't get me wrong, it's still really good to know what the absolute key is too. When transposing to any other key it's quite useful to be aware of it.

So in short: Glenn plays the song in the key of D, using Dropped D-Tuning, capoed on the 2nd fret, which puts him in the absolute key of E.

As for up and down...on the neck, when you go up in pitch, to the right on the neck, you say up the neck and vice versa. So Glenn slides up the neck to play G. I guess you already figured why because of the tuning, which Bart spotted.

As for voicings, especially when you use 'big' chords, meaning using all strings, like G or Em etc. it's easy when strumming (or picking) to leave one out. In other words you don't have to actually hit all of them. Like in Dropped D you can play G many different ways, like:

55000x
55003x
550033
550003
5x000x
5x003x
5x0033
5x0003
55043x
550433
5x543x
5x5433

You can see Glen using for example 5x003x. I suspect he's not aiming for the top string in that one. A 6 in the chord would sound a bit weird. He also uses G/B and I don't think he is neccessarily banging on the bottom string for that one as well (and if he does hit it a bit, it's not too bad, since D is a note in a G-chord). Personally I do things like that all the time. I fret what I need and if I don't, i simply don't hit it and vice versa. I indeed fret it when i want to play that particular string as well. With six string chords, you can do a lot.

In any way, many thanks for sharing this Mark! Pretty much my favorite Eagles-song. I play it in the key of G, capo II, which puts it in the absolute key of......???? :P

Or a much more difficult test, I know this song, in Dropped A-Tuning (the equivalent of Dropped D, two and a half steps down), key of G, capo II, which puts it in the absolute key of.....?? Anyone who figures that gets major kudos!!!!! :cheer: (No not you Shel, you should know the answer, since you already wrecked your brain all over it. :laugh: )

;)

spinland wrote:
Thanks for that clarification and yes: I mis-spoke (typed?). I know that D in capo2 is actually E, I meant the chord shapes themselves and the associated voicing. I'm still rather new at trying to express all this in proper verbiage.

So, I mean to say: as I understand the song the rhythm is generally played in E but with D shapes at capo2, and in my case I dropped it a full step to actual D to open up the upper vocal range for comfort. Is that closer to the accurate way to express the transposition thing? Always ready, willing and eager to learn. :side:

I didn't think about nonstandard tunings; of course! That's why I was having so much trouble figuring that out. Thanks!

Mark


spinland
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Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:53 am

Bill: Nice! Yeah, it is coolness, indeed.

Ness: Thanks for the kind words, and for the dissertation on capos, keys, and voicings. A lot of this thread is getting copy/pasted into my music notes folder. :woohoo:
I play it in the key of G, capo II, which puts it in the absolute key of......????
Absolute key of A, which is a beautiful piece of real estate but too rich for my voice's blood (unless I drop an octave). ;)
Or a much more difficult test, I know this song, in Dropped A-Tuning (the equivalent of Dropped D, two and a half steps down), key of G, capo II, which puts it in the absolute key of.....??
Hmm. If it's still in G/capo2 is it still absolute A even with the dropped tuning? :unsure:

Mark


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daryl
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Sun Apr 30, 2017 7:41 am

spinland wrote:
Or a much more difficult test, I know this song, in Dropped A-Tuning (the equivalent of Dropped D, two and a half steps down), key of G, capo II, which puts it in the absolute key of.....??
Hmm. If it's still in G/capo2 is it still absolute A even with the dropped tuning? :unsure:

Mark
Remember it only LOOKS like it's in G relative to capo2. If the guitar was in standard tuning then yes the absolute key would be A. But with the tuning all screwed up to Dropped-A then....

My guess is G/capo2 in dropped A-tuning is the absolute key of E.


TGNesh
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Sun Apr 30, 2017 8:21 am

:cheer: Well done Daryl, major kudos!

In thruth, I should've known, because when I said to Shel to hold off the answer I actually thought of you too, since you guessed it right a couple of years ago as well. And indeed, here you are! :laugh:

Cool!!

So when Shel and I were recording this song, I played it on the guitar, thinking in G and she played it on bass, obviously simply in the key of E. Actually that's why it's so useful to know the chord numbers.

Many roads lead to the same place. :)


daryl wrote:

Remember it only LOOKS like it's in G relative to capo2. If the guitar was in standard tuning then yes the absolute key would be A. But with the tuning all screwed up to Dropped-A then....

My guess is G/capo2 in dropped A-tuning is the absolute key of E.


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daryl
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Sun Apr 30, 2017 9:09 am

TGVanessa wrote:
:cheer: Well done Daryl, major kudos!

In thruth, I should've known, because when I said to Shel to hold off the answer I actually thought of you too, since you guessed it right a couple of years ago as well. And indeed, here you are! :laugh:

Cool!!

So when Shel and I were recording this song, I played it on the guitar, thinking in G and she played it on bass, obviously simply in the key of E. Actually that's why it's so useful to know the chord numbers.

Many roads lead to the same place. :)


daryl wrote:

Remember it only LOOKS like it's in G relative to capo2. If the guitar was in standard tuning then yes the absolute key would be A. But with the tuning all screwed up to Dropped-A then....

My guess is G/capo2 in dropped A-tuning is the absolute key of E.
Yay for me! But I don't remember the song or that I guessed right a couple year ago. :-( Sorry, but my memory is fading fast. :-(


wrsomers
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Sun Apr 30, 2017 11:07 am

TGVanessa wrote:
You can see Glen using for example 5x003x. I suspect he's not aiming for the top string in that one. A 6 in the chord would sound a bit weird. He also uses G/B and I don't think he is neccessarily banging on the bottom string for that one as well (and if he does hit it a bit, it's not too bad, since D is a note in a G-chord). Personally I do things like that all the time. I fret what I need and if I don't, i simply don't hit it and vice versa. I indeed fret it when i want to play that particular string as well. With six string chords, you can do a lot.
Well Ness,
Thanks for that clarification. I certainly had it wrong; especially with regard to the 6 in the G chord. x2003x or 5x003x both work very well. Thanks for setting me straight. Another cool G in drop D that I like to use is x20033 like in "Mr. Tambourine Man" or "Anticipation"

Bill


michelew
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Sun Apr 30, 2017 7:32 pm

Mark - Nice progress indeed. :)

Ness - Damn! And I knew the answer this time. :) hee hee. :)

TGVanessa wrote:
...

Or a much more difficult test, I know this song, in Dropped A-Tuning (the equivalent of Dropped D, two and a half steps down), key of G, capo II, which puts it in the absolute key of.....?? Anyone who figures that gets major kudos!!!!! :cheer: (No not you Shel, you should know the answer, since you already wrecked your brain all over it. :laugh: )

;)
There have definitely been times when a bass capo would have come in handy. :)


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