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abiliog
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Sun Aug 14, 2011 5:42 pm

That's very true Chris, this is Neil's and Matt's website, so for that I'm definitely not demanding an explanation.

But I do like to understand what's going on here. My question has been raised before and nothing came out of it, wich I find very strange to say the least. And now, again there are several members asking for more female-songs, with very valid reasons.

And now a Live Show is coming up wich is indeed for questions, questions that Neil and Matt might have answers for. So yeah, I'm asking in order to understand, that's what the show is for, to ask questions. And it's very possible that they won't have an answer for me that will satisfy me or the other members who are asking for the same thing. If so, then no one will be able to do anything about it and I will certainly leave it to that and try to accept it.

And please, don't start about the recommend a lesson-list, this is not about a particular song, this is about some balance in the Targetprogram.

I'm one of the thréé females active in the forum, among how many men?....well as you can imagine, there has to be a reason for that. And please guys, I love you all, but I'm sure you know what I mean, many of you have participated in the 'Lusting for women'-thread, wich was even started by a male, for wich I'm very grateful.

So no, Neil certainly doesn't have to explain himself. It's just me asking, if I don't ask, I will never understand.

Vanessa

neverfoundthetime wrote:
I'm just not sure Neil has to report to the principle's office to explain himself.


thereshopeyet
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Sun Aug 14, 2011 7:44 pm

Neil
Can you give some practice guidance, learning landmarks (before moving to the next level) and a demonstration with respect to mastering scales from beginner to intermediate to Advanced.

Thanks

Dermot


thereshopeyet
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Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:52 am

My problem is that the barre chords sound like an exercise of separate individual chords rather than musically linked chords.

Neil, can you explain / demonstrate / breakdown how to practice the barre chord changes using Sister Golden Hair as an example as I have been learning it.

Thanks

:S


michelew
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Mon Aug 15, 2011 7:21 am

neverfoundthetime wrote:
Oh man, Neil you have some explaining to do!
And I want to know why the entire collection of Moody Blues songs from Days of Future Past to Sur La Mer is not up there either :P

... just teasing you Vanessa!
Gee Chris I didn't even know there was a Head Master's office. Where would that be? Neither a canning nor a 10,000 word easy and detention were suggested here

It would, however, be nice to find out what Neil has in the pipeline along these lines as his response suggested.

To be fair, of the 16, some of those turned up after the last discussion; such as Joni Mitchell and Steveie Nicks from memory. I'm still hoping that the suggestions in the recent thread will give Neil some more inspiration for additional songs written and sung by women, especially since it is not just the women on the site that appear to be interested.

So I also support the question.

Michele


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neverfoundthetime
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Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:11 am

Gee Shel, you guys ganging up on me when I'm already on your side?
Girls, get a grip! you are missing the point: Neil cannot explain what he hasn't done. He can only explain what he has done.Or do you think he's deliberately ignoring the great female influences? Everyone would appreciate more songs from female song writers and he's already mentioned there is something on the way.
I'm going back to my knitting....


MarkM
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Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:53 am

No Chris, I'm sorry, but you are missing the point yourself...

And you know what, forget that I brought it up again, had the nerve to ask in the first place and to express something that I'm bothered about....something wich bothers several members, men and women, something wich was brought up like a year and a half ago already....

Anyway, I certainly won't do it again.

'Get a grip girls'.....right....16 out of 300....right..

I'm going back to figuring female-songs out by myself.

neverfoundthetime wrote:
Girls, get a grip! you are missing the point:


lueders
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Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:01 am



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neverfoundthetime
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Mon Aug 15, 2011 10:00 am

Vanessa: Nice to have this little chat!

I did PM you already to have the detailed discussion there instead of here and as you haven't answered my PM but have answered here I'll make the points I had in mind here and then leave it or talk it through with you on PM, which I'd prefer.

Don't be upset by my teasing, leg-pulling style mixed with serious comment. I'm discussing the issue and maintaining at all times my respect and like for you as a person while not shying away from the point of view I want to put. If you feel I'm sticking the boot in, it's only a big furry, knitted sock I'm wearing.

As I have now said many times, I agree, we would all appreciate more female written/performed songs. So I am am on your side all the way.

Yes we should attract more females to TG. How could I not agree with that!
I'm not sure how many more female members we would actually attract if we had another, say, 50 female songs but maybe a few more would sign up. I don't know. The more the merrier.

You wanted to "understand what's going on here". I'm suggesting, nothing. It's only in retrospect that the spotlight has been shone on the ratio of Male/female written/performed songs. It may appear on the face of it to be a disregard of women writer/ performers. I'm suggesting its accident and not design. For me it's an odd position to take, asking for an explanation of "what's going on here". The question implies a position taken by Neil which I think he has not taken. I don't think there is any position to be explained in this respect. And to me its obvious.

And I'm not sure what all the upset is about. The thread has called for more female oriented songs and many support the request. Neil has already acknowledged the thread and indicated there's something coming. Call heard. Your question of why seems to me to be more focussed on the problem than the solution. Wouldn't you rather be looking forward than back?

I am not sure that 50% of songs are written by women and 50% by men. I have no idea what the stats are but I'd guess at 30/70. I couldn't find any results for this question. I think there are more women performers than women writers, but that's just my perception. I'd love to know the answers to these questions. Probably, the base of acoustic songs to be drawn from has a large male bias to begin with. Not as much as 95% though, for sure.

I'm not sure why you wouldn't ask another question just because I've picked you up on this one. Either you have good reason and want an answer or not. This is an open forum, let the arguments be put and alternative views and questions be asked. When the dust settles on a discussion, usually the strongest, most substantiated argument is left standing. I'll always bow to greater wisdom and knowledge to that which I have in any given moment.

I'm not going to apologise for being a little provocative with my "get a grip" comment as it's only a little bit provocative and I'm teasing you girls and think you can take it. You just have to believe me when I say I mean no harm or disrespect and I know it's risky mixing quips with serious points but there you go... you have to admit, it's not boring!

Worse things happen at sea.

PS: Write us a song and post a video... redress the balance! I am sure you have a song or two up your sleeve.

Peace, love and a cupa tea all round.


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neverfoundthetime
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Mon Aug 15, 2011 10:13 am

Thank you for your time to explain your opinion about this matter Chris. I didn't get into your pm just yet, because I wasn't sure what to say or not.

However, I'm stepping aside now and save my energy for just playing the guitar.

Cheers all!

neverfoundthetime wrote:
Vanessa: Nice to have this little chat!

I did PM you already to have the detailed discussion there instead of here and as you haven't answered my PM but have answered here I'll make the points I had in mind here and then leave it or talk it through with you on PM, which I'd prefer.

Don't be upset by my teasing, leg-pulling style mixed with serious comment. I'm discussing the issue and maintaining at all times my respect and like for you as a person while not shying away from the point of view I want to put. If you feel I'm sticking the boot in, it's only a big furry, knitted sock I'm wearing.

As I have now said many times, I agree, we would all appreciate more female written/performed songs. So I am am on your side all the way.

Yes we should attract more females to TG. How could I not agree with that!
I'm not sure how many more female members we would actually attract if we had another, say, 50 female songs but maybe a few more would sign up. I don't know. The more the merrier.

You wanted to "understand what's going on here". I'm suggesting, nothing. It's only in retrospect that the spotlight has been shone on the ratio of Male/female written/performed songs. It may appear on the face of it to be a disregard of women writer/ performers. I'm suggesting its accident and not design. For me it's an odd position to take, asking for an explanation of "what's going on here". The question implies a position taken by Neil which I think he has not taken. I don't think there is any position to be explained in this respect. And to me its obvious.

And I'm not sure what all the upset is about. The thread has called for more female oriented songs and many support the request. Neil has already acknowledged the thread and indicated there's something coming. Call heard. Your question of why seems to me to be more focussed on the problem than the solution. Wouldn't you rather be looking forward than back?

I am not sure that 50% of songs are written by women and 50% by men. I have no idea what the stats are but I'd guess at 30/70. I couldn't find any results for this question. I think there are more women performers than women writers, but that's just my perception. I'd love to know the answers to these questions. Probably, the base of acoustic songs to be drawn from has a large male bias to begin with. Not as much as 95% though, for sure.

I'm not sure why you wouldn't ask another question just because I've picked you up on this one. Either you have good reason and want an answer or not. This is an open forum, let the arguments be put and alternative views and questions be asked. When the dust settles on a discussion, usually the strongest, most substantiated argument is left standing. I'll always bow to greater wisdom and knowledge to that which I have in any given moment.

I'm not going to apologise for being a little provocative with my "get a grip" comment as it's only a little bit provocative and I'm teasing you girls and think you can take it. You just have to believe me when I say I mean no harm or disrespect and I know it's risky mixing quips with serious points but there you go... you have to admit, it's not boring!

Worse things happen at sea.

PS: Write us a song and post a video... redress the balance! I am sure you have a song or two up your sleeve.

Peace, love and a cupa tea all round.


suziko
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Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:04 am

Chris,

Thank you for taking the time to write. I would like to try to give you some perspective on why I feel the way I do. About a year and a half ago, this subject was raised on the forum.
Here's the link to the thread, in case you would like to re-read it:

http://www.totallyguitars.com/forum/2-r ... tists.html

In that thread, one thing Matt said, in response to why there are not more songs by women offered in the Target program was:

if you recommend a song - make sure you have thought about its impact as a teaching asset....most tunes by female artists to Neil's point are either simple to learn, or downright basic after you lean some of the tunes here...or provide no extra teaching value.. (italics mine)

I responded to Matt's comment, positing that MOST songs are simple to learn, whether they're done by men or by women. We have had plenty of songs added this year to the Target program which are very easy to learn. A few that come to mind, without looking at the list, would be The Youngblood's "Get Together," Guster's "Do You Love Me?" and Ray LaMontagne's "Beg, Steal or Borrow."

You say it's accidental and not by design. I certainly am not suggesting that there is some sort of nefarious agreement on the part of Neil and Matt's to exclude songs by women. What I am suggesting is that there may be, based on what Matt said, the opinion that many songs by women are too easy and not worth adding to the program. That is an opinion with which I firmly disagree.

I'd also like to say that I, for one, came to the site precisely because I was doing a search for a song done by a female artists (or artists): "Closer to Fine" by the Indigo Girls. So I do think it's certainly possible that we would attract more women to the site if we had more songs by women.

I would also like to add that I really appreciate the songs by women that have been added in the past 18 months (basically, since the time of the previously-mentioned thread). Songs such as "Freight Train," "Closer to Fine," "Fields of Gold (Eva Cassidy version)," and "Circle Game." I certainly am not trying to imply that there has been no effort made on the part of Neil to add more songs by women. As someone before me said, the women songwriter's package was a step in the right direction. I'm just trying to say, "More, please!!"

Lastly, I'd like to remind you that the forum is the place for people to express their opinions and feelings in a respectful, polite way. The point of this thread was to elicit questions for Neil for the upcoming TG Live. Vanessa posted a question that she, and other people, would like to see discussed in more depth. To be told to "get a grip" after that seems neither respectful nor productive, even if it's is meant in jest.


Suzi


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