Timing help!
Neil, I've been using this site to learn for a while now. Mostly campfire stuff, but I've been playing the guitar for about 30 years, and want to progress. I know lots of chords, but am told by my in laws, that my timing is difficult to play WITH... I'm frustrated, and really ready to start all over if I have to. Seriously, I have never put any effort into timing, but would like to now. I want to be able to play with others. Problem is, I've been in the military so long, retired now, 53 years old, and have basically played for myself and by myself, with the exception as an early teenager when I played with friends (joined the Navy weeks after turning 17). I love the guitar, but am really stuck... I need direction! I'm not one of those folks that knows everything, I just want to be really good at the things I do know. Please help! Frustrated in Wisconsin.
I think when you play campfire songs,that is only strumming you must be able to play with others and see that has the rhytnm part(guitarist),,of course you must do that in time or a steady strumming,,when i play with friends a do mostly the rhytnm part,,i'm not able yet to play lead.
Maybe a good learning song(here in target)is ''and i love her'' by the Beatles and try all the parts,,you can use guitarpro for play along and mute the guitar(after a while) that you play and slow the tempo down to a speed you can handle..
Never,,never let your strumming hand stop or hesistate(it's your metronome),,when you go wrong don't stop but try to pick it up
goodluck,it is a pleaser to play with others...
Maybe a good learning song(here in target)is ''and i love her'' by the Beatles and try all the parts,,you can use guitarpro for play along and mute the guitar(after a while) that you play and slow the tempo down to a speed you can handle..
Never,,never let your strumming hand stop or hesistate(it's your metronome),,when you go wrong don't stop but try to pick it up
goodluck,it is a pleaser to play with others...
Welcome Robroy!!! Timing huh?? I, like you, and many others I presume have started out and continued to play for our own enjoyment. Therefore timing becomes somewhat mute as we are playing a song for our own enjoyment. Let me try to explain. If you listen to the studio version of Neil Youngs Cowgirl in the Sand and then listen to his solo acoustic version on Massey Hall you'll notice that they are completely different besides stating the obvious electric vs acoustic. Neil Young will take liberties with the song when he plays it himself. I had this issue when I first started playing with others in that the songs that I knew while playing by myself didn't work when playing with a much more seasoned player as he was trying to follow me but couldn't becasue I wasn't keeping an exact 4/4 time.
What I have begun to do is think more of the beat when playing and will, when first learning a song, play with the recording and in some cases us a metronome. Most of all, in my case though, is to make sure that your strumming hand continues to move up/down regardless if you are playing any notes or if you are flat picking out individual notes. Neil stresses this in just about every lesson here and I agree that it really is imperitive to mainting the timing throughout the song. Even if your hand cadence isn't the same as the original (slower if you are just learning the song) it will be constant throughout. Once your strumming hand becomes your metronome you'll be in great shape. I'm not sure if I described this accurately enough but I hope it helps.
MarkM
What I have begun to do is think more of the beat when playing and will, when first learning a song, play with the recording and in some cases us a metronome. Most of all, in my case though, is to make sure that your strumming hand continues to move up/down regardless if you are playing any notes or if you are flat picking out individual notes. Neil stresses this in just about every lesson here and I agree that it really is imperitive to mainting the timing throughout the song. Even if your hand cadence isn't the same as the original (slower if you are just learning the song) it will be constant throughout. Once your strumming hand becomes your metronome you'll be in great shape. I'm not sure if I described this accurately enough but I hope it helps.
MarkM
I think you need to find what is wrong with your timing.
Is the tempo irregular where you slow down and speed up?
Are you putting in or missing out beats?
Or are you generally out of time - this would suggest that you aren't keeping your strumming hand regular.
As others have said playing along to a metronome, drum machine or Guitar Pro is very usefull.
Start with something really simple, like a camp fire with a few chords and make sure you get this in time.
Is the tempo irregular where you slow down and speed up?
Are you putting in or missing out beats?
Or are you generally out of time - this would suggest that you aren't keeping your strumming hand regular.
As others have said playing along to a metronome, drum machine or Guitar Pro is very usefull.
Start with something really simple, like a camp fire with a few chords and make sure you get this in time.
mark wrote:
Marks point remembered me to a thing i had in the beginning(maybe now too),,when i was counting 1-2-3-4 i did not count that equal so the 1 or the 2 were longer or shorter..I think you need to find what is wrong with your timing.
Is the tempo irregular where you slow down and speed up?
Are you putting in or missing out beats?
Or are you generally out of time - this would suggest that you aren't keeping your strumming hand regular.
As others have said playing along to a metronome, drum machine or Guitar Pro is very usefull.
Start with something really simple, like a camp fire with a few chords and make sure you get this in time.
Welcome from the Netherlands RobRoy!
I see that you've already gotten some usefull advice and suggestions. And if you really want Neil to take a look at it or give you some advice (since you put this question in the 'Ask Neil'-thread), why don't you post a video, so that he can review it? It could open up a world for you!
But whatever you like of course, all the best and good luck on your 'timing-journey',
Cheers
Vanessa
I see that you've already gotten some usefull advice and suggestions. And if you really want Neil to take a look at it or give you some advice (since you put this question in the 'Ask Neil'-thread), why don't you post a video, so that he can review it? It could open up a world for you!
But whatever you like of course, all the best and good luck on your 'timing-journey',
Cheers
Vanessa
robroy wrote:
it's not the end of the world and at least you are not talking about quiting, there's quite an easy way of finding out where you are going wrong. Firstly video yourself playing a campfire style song and either watch it yourself or post it for critique, either here or to the student appraisal section for Neil to see. As soon as you play on tape, it will be obvious to most what is wrong. If this is a step too far for you, watch the tape yourself.
A lot of people and even professional musicians have a habit of speeding up as they perform, I guess they just get excited. I am an editor by day and have edited professional band videos. The way we keep them in time with themselves is to play their cd out loud and they play or pretend to play along with themselves many times and camera angles over. so can't help being in time for each single camera take. When you don't do this, the timing can be a long way out over the piece and this can make editing it a nightmare, as each take will be slightly different in length and out of sync with each other.
So, don't worry it is fixable. It's a good idea when learning a song at some stage to put it to test with a metronome, slowly at first, then eventually to a faster speed, then full speed. As someone else mentioned, if you have guitar Pro you can play along with the song at various speeds starting slow and getting progressively faster each time. This is one of the main methods I use and find it invaluable. You can play along with Neil, that's the equivalent of playing with a n other guitarist or musician is it not? Patience is needed here, but if you persevere it will pay off. Some guitarist tap their feet, some use a metronome. If you employ these tactics I think your family might get a shock the next time you play along with them. I really think you should think seriously about videoing yourself though, this will tell you everything you need to know about your playing and tempo. You may have to go over all your songs and straighten them out once you know exactly what is happening. Your technique may just need a small tweak if you have a bad habit.
That's my tuppence worth for now. Good luck with your playing! and keep us posted with your progress. Great name by the way Rob Roy, a famous Scot from history.
Tom N.
p.s. Hey Nesh great minds think alike you beat me to it. :laugh:
Hi frustrated in Wisconsin,I know lots of chords, but am told by my in laws, that my timing is difficult to play WITH... I'm frustrated, and really ready to start all over if I have to. Seriously, I have never put any effort into timing, but would like to now. I want to be able to play with others. Problem is, I've been in the military so long, retired now, 53 years old, and have basically played for myself and by myself, with the exception as an early teenager when I played with friends I love the guitar, but am really stuck... I need direction! I'm not one of those folks that knows everything, I just want to be really good at the things I do know. Please help! Frustrated in Wisconsin.
it's not the end of the world and at least you are not talking about quiting, there's quite an easy way of finding out where you are going wrong. Firstly video yourself playing a campfire style song and either watch it yourself or post it for critique, either here or to the student appraisal section for Neil to see. As soon as you play on tape, it will be obvious to most what is wrong. If this is a step too far for you, watch the tape yourself. A lot of people and even professional musicians have a habit of speeding up as they perform, I guess they just get excited. I am an editor by day and have edited professional band videos. The way we keep them in time with themselves is to play their cd out loud and they play or pretend to play along with themselves many times and camera angles over. so can't help being in time for each single camera take. When you don't do this, the timing can be a long way out over the piece and this can make editing it a nightmare, as each take will be slightly different in length and out of sync with each other.
So, don't worry it is fixable. It's a good idea when learning a song at some stage to put it to test with a metronome, slowly at first, then eventually to a faster speed, then full speed. As someone else mentioned, if you have guitar Pro you can play along with the song at various speeds starting slow and getting progressively faster each time. This is one of the main methods I use and find it invaluable. You can play along with Neil, that's the equivalent of playing with a n other guitarist or musician is it not? Patience is needed here, but if you persevere it will pay off. Some guitarist tap their feet, some use a metronome. If you employ these tactics I think your family might get a shock the next time you play along with them. I really think you should think seriously about videoing yourself though, this will tell you everything you need to know about your playing and tempo. You may have to go over all your songs and straighten them out once you know exactly what is happening. Your technique may just need a small tweak if you have a bad habit.
That's my tuppence worth for now. Good luck with your playing! and keep us posted with your progress. Great name by the way Rob Roy, a famous Scot from history.
Tom N.
p.s. Hey Nesh great minds think alike
you beat me to it. :laugh:Thanks Wiley, I will try your suggestions. I sound/You sound - a lot like my circumstance. Just having a place to start is great, finding a lot of help here at totallyguitars. Again, I will do as you advise. Get back to you in the near future and tell you how it is going.
RobRoy
RobRoy
Thank you, to all on this topic. I will try all suggestions, film, metronome, student appraisal for Neil, play along, etc... what a great source of help. Glad to see I'm not the only one that had/has problems with timing, but great to hear people that have found solutions.
P.S. Tom N., lived in Scotland for 3 years with the Navy, the "NATIVES" nicked me RobRoy (my name is Robin Royster). After that, I learned everything about him, as well as many other historic figures in Scottish History. Great bunch of people there, and here at TotallyGuitars, appreciate everything folks. I'm too old to take anything for granted!
P.S. Tom N., lived in Scotland for 3 years with the Navy, the "NATIVES" nicked me RobRoy (my name is Robin Royster). After that, I learned everything about him, as well as many other historic figures in Scottish History. Great bunch of people there, and here at TotallyGuitars, appreciate everything folks. I'm too old to take anything for granted!