I give UP! - Never Going Back Again. Or... Maybe not.

[michelew]

I've been revisiting alternate tuning songs recently, including one that I ironically revisit fairly regularly, Never Going Back Again. I'm stuck. I just can't do the pinky barre. My finger just can't bend like that and when it does its uncontrollable and will flick out of the partial barre of its own accord.

Unless by some coincidence someone has a trick for me that means I don't have to barre my pinky then I think I'm going to just have to admit defeat. I've tried using my third and fourth fingers together at the 8th fret instead and that's just plain awkward, one note is dead and my third isn't behaving anyway.

I'm normally known for being persistent and I normally find that if I want to play something badly enough I can make progress if I slow it down enough and just repeat it into submission. Well as a minimum, I generally manage to make progress. I just don't belive I'll ever be able to do the pinky barre.

So...I GIVE UP!!!! B) you've got to admit when you're plain beat sometimes,right?!


Anyone want to share an 'I give UP!" story? Or maybe a tale of hope; how you thought you would never do it, but then found a way?

Defeated, but that's OK. thanks for listening.

Shel

[willem]

Okay, one song/tune less to be learned,there are so many others,, :laugh:

I think I will never be able to fingerpick with the gear in his six..such as Dust in the wind and why should I bother 'cos I love slow ballads.

One song also very speedy and tricky "I love you more" by Racoon I wil never give up and keep trying..

I still 'm frustraded that I lose the timing in a song, I keep trying, I never give up!

Can we fake it?

Maby try to play with feeling and concentrade on the lyrics and his frasings

B)

Willem

[daryl]

It's OK to admit defeat. But before you really throw in the towel, why don't you post a video of the troublesome spot and maybe someone and give you a pointer or two.

As for me, I've thrown in the towel on hinged barre chords (partial or full). My 3rd finger simply can not bend that way. The other thing I've mostly given up on is playing notes on the 6th string with my thumb. I just can't get my short stubby thumb to wrap around the neck while the other fingers are playing a chord.

[Lavallee]

Hi Michele, I sure can relate to your frustration. For me it is the song Solsbury Hills. I was so much looking forward to that song. Neil gave a great lesson. But after trying for months and months, I could never get the speed it needed. So I've let it go, with much regret.

Daryl, the thumb wrap is also more than just a challenge for me . When I have notes on the first or second string at the same time, I get a thump sound from my thumb wrap because it always end up over the fret instead of before the fret. I am trying to work on alternative fingering when it calls for it with less than moderate success . I know that Angi that I want to work on has a dreaded thumb wrap. I will see how it comes.

Marc

[TGNeil]

michelew wrote:

I've been revisiting alternate tuning songs recently, including one that I ironically revisit fairly regularly, Never Going Back Again. I'm stuck. I just can't do the pinky barre. My finger just can't bend like that and when it does its uncontrollable and will flick out of the partial barre of its own accord.

...

Shel

Hey Michele,

Here is a suggestion, and I guess a philosophical tangent as well. Many professional guitarists working on covers, or even original arrangements, will modify notes if they seem like too much trouble. This can appear to be creative license but the truth could be that it was just too hard to do it the way somebody else did. Maybe I will cite some examples on the News this week.

A completely acceptable solution here would be to change one of the offending notes to a different one in the same chord, preferably a filler (or inner note), and keep the melody intact. There is a good solution to this problem as far as Never Going Back Again is concerned.

End of hint one for now and get back to me with a workaround, maybe multiple ones.

Neil

[dekotaj]

daryl wrote:
[quote But before you really throw in the towel, why don't you post a video of the troublesome spot and maybe someone and give you a pointer or two.

Yes,Lets take a look.

Sorry your having so much trouble with it Sis.( but give up )no no no.
There been sooo many time that I been at a point in a song that I wonder if I will get it down. And so far,some how I work it out (some how??) With that being said. after 5 yr of trying a song out of my league. ( romanza ) I still can't play it well.It has taken some time to get the A section down.But a lot of the times I will get through it.Now the B section. (@#%$^%$#)Is were I have the most trouble.Some time I make it all the way to the last two chords.But those two never seem to get it clean.But I know why and it is just a matter of time. I WILL GET IT DOWN,even if it kills me!!!For the why.on the last two chords.As I work my way down the fret board. the frets get closer and my fingers crunch up down there.Then going back up the fret board the frets open back up.My old hands find it hard to open back up all the way.But some day I WILL get it!!!
I don't play the song your talking about.But there has to be a way.Add a little lead part, play the chord some were else on the fret board.As Neil said change some of the notes around,If its a picking song try strumming this section and don't strum all the way through the chord.Just got to be a way to get passed this spot.

Give'em hell Sis
Kev

[neverfoundthetime]

I feel your pain Shel (in my best Clinton voice)!

Recently, for me, its been sliding up the neck on Gypsy using an E shape but using my 1st finger to fret the bass string but not put on a full barre... this allows the high notes to stay open and ring like a bell and jangle a bit especially on the C chord. Lovely. But its such a bugger getting the G chord right as landing the fingers correctly is tricky form Em to G (and the G is an up-stroke!) but not A to C so much. I used to have this sequence down easy in the respective first positions but its just not the same sound and not what Neil teaches. Been at this for weeks now.

Also, using a pick, I am finding it really difficult to increase speed on the up-strokes, I just don't have the feel or dexterity for it. Yet.

But, there is hope as Neil riding in with the Cavalry! And he's not going to let you off any hooks, can't you just tell! :laugh:

Marc, to get the speed, after you've got all the moves down slow, play it 50% too fast and just let it be a mess but go fast. Then after a few times go back to try to play the near normal speed, you my find you can break the speed barrier you were at.

Chris

[michelew]

TGNeil wrote:

michelew wrote:

I've been revisiting alternate tuning songs recently, including one that I ironically revisit fairly regularly, Never Going Back Again. I'm stuck. I just can't do the pinky barre. My finger just can't bend like that and when it does its uncontrollable and will flick out of the partial barre of its own accord.

...

Shel

Hey Michele,

Here is a suggestion, and I guess a philosophical tangent as well. Many professional guitarists working on covers, or even original arrangements, will modify notes if they seem like too much trouble. This can appear to be creative license but the truth could be that it was just too hard to do it the way somebody else did. Maybe I will cite some examples on the News this week.

A completely acceptable solution here would be to change one of the offending notes to a different one in the same chord, preferably a filler (or inner note), and keep the melody intact. There is a good solution to this problem as far as Never Going Back Again is concerned.

End of hint one for now and get back to me with a workaround, maybe multiple ones.

Neil

So if you can't manage it, be creative and change the offending notes while keeping the character of the song. I like it. Nice.

Well I'm off to work but I'll try to solve the new challenge this evening. Always a sucker for a challenge.

Thanks Neil. It's a great song I love playing the different patterns with the thumb and fingers and the resulting sound.

So the irony may continue.

Shel

[michelew]

WIllem, Daryl, Marc, Kev and Chris,

Thanks guys. I figured that most people would have their own stories.

Kev - Romanza is a great example of where persistence pays off. I was getting stuck on fretting the D# (?) on the 11th fret with my pinky. I made that work at one point. The stretch(es) in the second section...Yep they're big. I've been playing my nylon a fair bit lately. So I think I'll revisit Romanza too. But, I've GOT to hear you playing it Kev. Niiiice!

WIllem - I reckon you can do Dust in the Wind. Maybe you could increase your speed by just working on one of the more straightforward sections over and over and increasing speed. That might help to solidify the picking pattern in your fingers. Maybe that will help you to increase the speed of the whole song. You could also try Chris' trick, which Neil has suggested to me before too.

Daryl - it looks like the Master won't let me give up. but he's good with cheating. so you may still hear me play this. - Yep those hinge and partial barres and thumb wraps, got to love 'Em.

Marc - the thumb wrap, yeh ouch. On a classical it's just insane. Re: the speed thing, Chris' suggestion works. It's funny how the brain adjusts, like when you come off a Freeway and suddenly you're doing 60 k/hr through a town, but you feel like your standing still. It might help you to squeeze a little more juice out of your fingers.

Chris - hinged barres again - lots of tricky bits in Gypsy by the sound of it. Show us your hard work when you're ready. And yep, now that Neil's hinted at a workable solution I guess I might just manage this one after all.

Thanks guys. It's good to hear what's challenging for you all. somehow it just helps to compare notes.

Shel

[fjeanmur]

Great topic, Michelle! (Although it's not great that you're frustrated.). I think Neil probably came up with the best answer--that sometimes you just need some "work arounds."

I was having that trouble of putting the third finger over the fourth that Vanessa and Neil helped me with (and the problem started to correct itself quite quickly!). Now just for those big stretches in the second part. They're coming, but clumsy, but I know Sandy has some work arounds. Maybe I'll have to pick her brain.

I retreated a while ago on the second part of Romanza. The first part was easy enough, but I found myself becoming disoriented between reading the music and finding the right frets on the guitar. Maybe after Rosa May I'll give it another try.

But I loved seeing everyone's tales of their "Terrible Tunes." It makes me want to check them out to see what makes them so terrible.

Keep going, Michelle.

BTW- Why does Kevin call you "sis?" Is the answer the obvious?